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	Comments on: The Claremont Amphitheatre as a problem in historic garden restoration	</title>
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	<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/</link>
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		<title>
		By: Tom Turner		</title>
		<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4351</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom Turner]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jun 2012 16:33:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/?p=7493#comment-4351</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4350&quot;&gt;Stephen Wass&lt;/a&gt;.

Thank you for the comment - sorry I could not get the link to work.
I agree that we cannot get back to anywhere.  I am, today, in a place which I knew very well 50 years ago.  In one sense, it is remarkably unchanged. But in other ways, it is completely different.
As an (amateur historian) I am very keen to get back to as many periods in history as I can. Books help and so do reconstructions, whether they are drawings or physical reconstructions.
With Chiswick and Claremont, I think they are precious relics and anything which can be done in the interests of historical accuracy should be done. Any other policy would seem like changing the words in an original copy of a Shakespeare play.
Re archaeologists - I love what they do and read a lot of their books, always believing that they probably make as many mistakes as any other profession and that they are in need of critical commentary to keep them on their toes!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4350">Stephen Wass</a>.</p>
<p>Thank you for the comment &#8211; sorry I could not get the link to work.<br />
I agree that we cannot get back to anywhere.  I am, today, in a place which I knew very well 50 years ago.  In one sense, it is remarkably unchanged. But in other ways, it is completely different.<br />
As an (amateur historian) I am very keen to get back to as many periods in history as I can. Books help and so do reconstructions, whether they are drawings or physical reconstructions.<br />
With Chiswick and Claremont, I think they are precious relics and anything which can be done in the interests of historical accuracy should be done. Any other policy would seem like changing the words in an original copy of a Shakespeare play.<br />
Re archaeologists &#8211; I love what they do and read a lot of their books, always believing that they probably make as many mistakes as any other profession and that they are in need of critical commentary to keep them on their toes!</p>
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		<title>
		By: Stephen Wass		</title>
		<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4350</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Stephen Wass]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jun 2012 14:30:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/?p=7493#comment-4350</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[As an archaeologist working on the newly &#039;discovered&#039; amphitheatre at Farnborough Hall, Warwickshire http://www.polyolbion.org.uk/Farnborough/October-November11.htm
I too have recently visited Claremont. I felt very clear that what I was looking at was primarily an artefact of the twentieth century allbeit with roots in the eighteenth, further restoration would simply be adding an additional level of interpretation from the perspective now of the twenty first century which is fine providing we don&#039;t kid ourselves that we are somehow recapturing an authentic experience of an eighteenth century garden. It can&#039;t be done, we are not the same people.  As you can see I am something of a sceptic when it comes to  reconstruction. Not that such activities don&#039;t have their place but their function to instruct, entertain and possibly inspire but it&#039;s not &#039;the real thing&#039;.

In terms of usage I do believe that there are big issues here  thrown for me into stark relief by the experience of visiting Chiswick. Here we have the amphitheatre fenced off and, I was told by the staff, alarmed to prevent access at pretty well all times contrasted with the rest of the garden which exhibits a pattern of activity: ball games, dog exercising, which would seem more at home on a recreation ground. I&#039;m sure Chiswick would work better for me if the amphitheatre were opened up a little and the gardens closed down a touch.

P.S. Please don&#039;t give archaeologists quite such a hard time. Yes we do get it wrong occasionally but if you saw the hoops we are having to jump through to conduct even the most modest amount of digging within the boundaries of a National Trust property you would be sobbing in sympathy - well almost.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As an archaeologist working on the newly &#8216;discovered&#8217; amphitheatre at Farnborough Hall, Warwickshire <a href="http://www.polyolbion.org.uk/Farnborough/October-November11.htm" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.polyolbion.org.uk/Farnborough/October-November11.htm</a><br />
I too have recently visited Claremont. I felt very clear that what I was looking at was primarily an artefact of the twentieth century allbeit with roots in the eighteenth, further restoration would simply be adding an additional level of interpretation from the perspective now of the twenty first century which is fine providing we don&#8217;t kid ourselves that we are somehow recapturing an authentic experience of an eighteenth century garden. It can&#8217;t be done, we are not the same people.  As you can see I am something of a sceptic when it comes to  reconstruction. Not that such activities don&#8217;t have their place but their function to instruct, entertain and possibly inspire but it&#8217;s not &#8216;the real thing&#8217;.</p>
<p>In terms of usage I do believe that there are big issues here  thrown for me into stark relief by the experience of visiting Chiswick. Here we have the amphitheatre fenced off and, I was told by the staff, alarmed to prevent access at pretty well all times contrasted with the rest of the garden which exhibits a pattern of activity: ball games, dog exercising, which would seem more at home on a recreation ground. I&#8217;m sure Chiswick would work better for me if the amphitheatre were opened up a little and the gardens closed down a touch.</p>
<p>P.S. Please don&#8217;t give archaeologists quite such a hard time. Yes we do get it wrong occasionally but if you saw the hoops we are having to jump through to conduct even the most modest amount of digging within the boundaries of a National Trust property you would be sobbing in sympathy &#8211; well almost.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tom Turner		</title>
		<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4349</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom Turner]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Mar 2012 07:53:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/?p=7493#comment-4349</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I did not make my point very well. My intended meaning was (1) the quality of the garden should very high (2) it should not take on the character of a public park (3) my impression is that the middle classes prefer Claremont to their local parks because you need a car and spare cash to get in - so the people they do not want to encounter on leisure occasions are not there. Aristocrats and billionaires tend to have their own parks with high fences and security guards, so they do not need to visit National Trust Properties for relaxation - only for cultural interests.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did not make my point very well. My intended meaning was (1) the quality of the garden should very high (2) it should not take on the character of a public park (3) my impression is that the middle classes prefer Claremont to their local parks because you need a car and spare cash to get in &#8211; so the people they do not want to encounter on leisure occasions are not there. Aristocrats and billionaires tend to have their own parks with high fences and security guards, so they do not need to visit National Trust Properties for relaxation &#8211; only for cultural interests.</p>
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		<title>
		By: L.Penman		</title>
		<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4348</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[L.Penman]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Mar 2012 11:24:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/?p=7493#comment-4348</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&quot;..: it is in danger of becoming a public park for the middle classes.&quot;

Find it offencive and snobbish. Are midddle classes still regarded as plebs? Shell we restore the place to its glory so aristocrates could walk there instead of plebs?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;..: it is in danger of becoming a public park for the middle classes.&#8221;</p>
<p>Find it offencive and snobbish. Are midddle classes still regarded as plebs? Shell we restore the place to its glory so aristocrates could walk there instead of plebs?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tom Turner		</title>
		<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4347</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom Turner]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Oct 2011 14:33:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/?p=7493#comment-4347</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4346&quot;&gt;Stephen Harmer&lt;/a&gt;.

See blog post on what archaeology did to a &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/2011/10/11/archaeologists-wreck-archaeological-landscapes-and-ancient-silk-road-cities/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;deserted silk road city in central Asia&lt;/a&gt;.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4346">Stephen Harmer</a>.</p>
<p>See blog post on what archaeology did to a <a href="http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/2011/10/11/archaeologists-wreck-archaeological-landscapes-and-ancient-silk-road-cities/" rel="nofollow">deserted silk road city in central Asia</a>.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Stephen Harmer		</title>
		<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4346</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Stephen Harmer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Oct 2011 12:38:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/?p=7493#comment-4346</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[You are right Christine, if just one of these young students finds they enjoy history and is entralled by the Egyptian galleries then job done. As for the other bored young students, the saying you &#039;have to kiss a lot of frogs before you find a prince&#039;comes to mind.
I agree with Tom regarding some aspects of archaeology, the &#039;Time Team&#039; approach cannot be justifyed, but if ancient sites remain covered and not discovered, how will we learn? Maybe in another millennia the protection of sites will have more importance and the reruns of &#039;Time Team&#039; will be a distant memory.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You are right Christine, if just one of these young students finds they enjoy history and is entralled by the Egyptian galleries then job done. As for the other bored young students, the saying you &#8216;have to kiss a lot of frogs before you find a prince&#8217;comes to mind.<br />
I agree with Tom regarding some aspects of archaeology, the &#8216;Time Team&#8217; approach cannot be justifyed, but if ancient sites remain covered and not discovered, how will we learn? Maybe in another millennia the protection of sites will have more importance and the reruns of &#8216;Time Team&#8217; will be a distant memory.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tom Turner		</title>
		<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4345</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom Turner]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Oct 2011 08:14:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/?p=7493#comment-4345</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4344&quot;&gt;Christine&lt;/a&gt;.

That would be more than enough for me. Much though I like archaeology I think they dig up far too much, to further their careers, and leave it to be damaged by the elements. This is what is happening to Pompeii and I have seen a desert city being eroded in the wind which, had it been left unde the dunes, would have lasted for a few more millennia.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4344">Christine</a>.</p>
<p>That would be more than enough for me. Much though I like archaeology I think they dig up far too much, to further their careers, and leave it to be damaged by the elements. This is what is happening to Pompeii and I have seen a desert city being eroded in the wind which, had it been left unde the dunes, would have lasted for a few more millennia.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Christine		</title>
		<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4344</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Christine]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Oct 2011 07:55:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/?p=7493#comment-4344</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Maybe just one in a million will be a delighted dreamy child who has a future as an archaeologist!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe just one in a million will be a delighted dreamy child who has a future as an archaeologist!</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tom Turner		</title>
		<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4343</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom Turner]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Oct 2011 07:25:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/?p=7493#comment-4343</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4342&quot;&gt;Christine&lt;/a&gt;.

See above blog post on paradise.
The British Museum&#039;s Egyptian Galleries in the British Museum are among my favourite places in London - but their tranquility is usually destroyed by boring parties of bored school children learning how to tick boxes in preparation for their future careers as health and safety inspectors.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4342">Christine</a>.</p>
<p>See above blog post on paradise.<br />
The British Museum&#8217;s Egyptian Galleries in the British Museum are among my favourite places in London &#8211; but their tranquility is usually destroyed by boring parties of bored school children learning how to tick boxes in preparation for their future careers as health and safety inspectors.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Christine		</title>
		<link>https://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/the-claremont-amphitheatre-as-a-problem-in-historic-garden-restoration/#comment-4342</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Christine]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Oct 2011 01:26:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gardenvisit.com/blog/?p=7493#comment-4342</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[This morning on my walk through the botanic garden it was a little less like paradise as it was crowded with school groups and the beginnings of the lunchtime crowd. The oasis quality had been lost and even the animals were scurrying away from the noise and movement deeper into the vegetation of the gardenbeds.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This morning on my walk through the botanic garden it was a little less like paradise as it was crowded with school groups and the beginnings of the lunchtime crowd. The oasis quality had been lost and even the animals were scurrying away from the noise and movement deeper into the vegetation of the gardenbeds.</p>
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