Comments on: John Evelyn's garden at Sayes Court and the Convoys Wharf Urban Landscape Master Plan

By: sue

sue — Mon, 07 Nov 2011 02:01:12 +0000

Hi Tom, can we blog about your post on Deptford Is… ? (It’s a blog about the Convoys site and a campaign against it)…Please reply to my email address sue@fivetonine.co.uk, or deptfordis@yahoo.co.uk

By: Christine

Christine — Mon, 07 Nov 2011 00:06:36 +0000

The Borneo development in Amsterdam is very interesting. This analysis of the ‘urban theory'(?) [I would have thought ‘urban practice’] is also instructive, because it details both the aspects which were achieved and those that were modified as the project progressed. [ http://urbantheorywest8amsterdam.blogspot.com/ ]

Comparing the resulting aesthetic of the development to the large social housing (?) project in the background of the 4th photograph the strategy of engaging many designers has achieved a great result for the residents and the Amsterdam cityscape.[ http://www.west8.nl/projects/borneo_sporenburg/ ]

By: Tom Turner

Tom Turner — Sat, 05 Nov 2011 05:20:45 +0000

In reply to Christine. I like folded plates and it is always time for innovation, lateral thinking, forward thinking and backward thinking. The problem with the Convoys Wharf scheme is that it scarcely seems to have the benefit of any architectural thinking. It looks like the work of a design conglomerate which has developed a 'product', much as Nokia might develop a world phone, and now seeks to roll it out in London. To be fair though, there are two aspects of the scheme which I like (1) the projection of Deptford High Street to the River Thames (2) the creation of roof-garden style 'London Squares'. I think they should set about the project by designing the urban landscape first and the architecture second, as West 8 did for the Borneo development in Amsterdam. The architecture can then be much more varied and it can be the work of many more designers. The day of the megastructure was yesterday.

By: Christine

Christine — Sat, 05 Nov 2011 02:10:00 +0000

This comment may seem a little off topic, however, I am hoping to illustrate the importance of innovation in architecture resolving what might otherwise seem as incompatibilities in site opportunities.

Even though folded plate architecture [ http://www.eikongraphia.com/wordpress/wp-content/8%20FOA%20Yokohama%20Terminal.jpg ] and landscape architecture [ http://cdn.archdaily.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/02-entangled-bank-elevated-park-528×352.jpg ] are fashionable, opportunities to use them as solutions to design problems rather than as stylistic solutions are often missed.

They lend themsevles ideally to an ambiguous above ground/underground architectural vocabulary.
[ http://www.geckogo.com/Attraction/Finland/Southern-Finland/Helsinki/Temppeliaukion-Kirkko-Rock-Church/ ]

The Sayes Court scheme perhaps need further lateral thinking to fully incorporate the historical gems on the site (including Evelyn’s garden)?

By: Tom Turner

Tom Turner — Fri, 04 Nov 2011 17:44:19 +0000

In reply to Karen Liljenberg. Thank you. I would like to see a National Programme for restoring or re-creating gardens of first class historic importance. John Evelyn's Sayes Court would certainly be on the list (1) because of his importance (2) because of his role in introducing baroque ideas to England (3) because of scarcity of gardens from the period.

By: Karen Liljenberg

Karen Liljenberg — Fri, 04 Nov 2011 14:11:43 +0000

A great pleasure to read your post, Tom. I’ve been blogging for a while about Sayes Court over at http://londonslostgarden.wordpress.com and now there is actually a campaign afoot to rescue it from the “dustbin of history” and restore it.

By: Tom Turner

Tom Turner — Fri, 04 Nov 2011 10:22:30 +0000

There is a lot of information in the supporting documents but one has the impression that the design team has been ‘going through the motions’ instead of doing a serious job, as Evelyn would doubtless have wished, of exploring everything and keeping the best.

By: Michael Simonsen

Michael Simonsen — Fri, 04 Nov 2011 09:58:28 +0000

The important maps of the Environmental Statement Archaeology Technical Appendix are not north faced and not over layered with the situation today. Already on this point there lost the option of a larger context in the history of this place. With a view to Evelyn and his Sylva, or Discourse on Forest Trees and more them with his motto „Omnia explorate; meliora retinete“, the place could be better development. But in this time the ignorance of investors is like the same as Charles II in 1666. Just with this short term investment view about 10 to 15 years is develop a place for the next two or three generations.