Comments on: Deptford Creek London Landscape Archaeology

By: Tom Turner

Tom Turner — Thu, 24 Apr 2014 05:49:24 +0000

In reply to Jacquey Thurlow. I support Boris Johnson's idea for making the PLA a department of the GLA - so that it can embrace the non-maritime objectives of river management.

By: Jacquey Thurlow

Jacquey Thurlow — Wed, 23 Apr 2014 21:31:37 +0000

in reply to your comment number 17, Tom. There are all sorts of regulations with regard to ‘working the river’. Contact the Maritime and Coastguard Agency or the Port of London Authority and if they give you a straight answer, let all the seamen working the River know please as they are totally confused about what is needed nowadays!! LOL

By: Amz

Amz — Sun, 11 Apr 2010 20:59:12 +0000

Hey,

Do you know the name of the ship? I need to research it for a project.

Thanks

By: Tom Turner

Tom Turner — Sat, 05 Sep 2009 20:02:58 +0000

Jacquey, thank you for your comment. Can you tell me if Barge Skippers have to pay for a license to use the river?

By: Jacquey Thurlow

Jacquey Thurlow — Thu, 03 Sep 2009 17:53:56 +0000

I fell upon this site quite by chance when looking into the history of Brewery Wharf. I am the Partner of one of the Barge Skippers who has been about on the London River for a long time (50+ years). Maybe the work of these sea-faring men should also be considered in your Thesis, Fiona. You know, each barge load saves at least 10 lorries being on our roads-not just in Deptford but in Fingringhoe which is a very small village in Essex and en route too. Please lets not get rid of all traditions. After all, the original Ocre Sailed Barges are being restored and everyone loves to see them about our rivers and coastal waters, they are mainly used for sail training schemes now and would not be viable for transporting goods etc nowadays but there have already been comments on the more nautical sites like “where are the Prior Barges gone? they have been running up under the bridges for over 100 years and are missed by local people”. Brewery Wharf is the furthest they go a present, it’s difficult to understand the skill that is needed to deliver a cargo or two in there and ‘turn’ on the tide to get away again weighing up the course/exit speed of the land-water from the River Ravensbourne too. We all need the aggregate which is brought in, sometimes overnight, depending on the tides, it takes roughly 2-3 hours to unload two boats, just think of how that reduces noise ad pollution from lorries. Just a few thoughts which may help your studies from a ‘practical student’.

By: Tom Turner

Tom Turner — Sat, 01 Aug 2009 07:05:53 +0000

Fiona, you are right in spirit (and your tutors are disgracefully wrong!) but it is also necessary to strike a balance between the past, the present and the future. My view of how to approach Deptford Creek is by looking at the area from many different points of view, which can be regarded as those of ‘stakeholders’ (though it is an ugly word). Local history enthusiasts, remembering when it was a royal shipyard and Peter the Great worked here are important. So are ecologists who care about the redstart. So are dancers. So are boat owners. So are landowners etc. I like the theoretical idea of each group preparing a ‘plan’ and then seeing what can be done to integrate the plans. The greatest danger is of handing each plot over to money-mad developers who, like your tutors, want to just call in the bulldozers. This is a key difference between architecture, which has to be client-led, and urban design, which OUGHT to take on wider briefs from more disparate community groups, past, present and future.

By: Fiona

Fiona — Fri, 31 Jul 2009 08:05:36 +0000

Interesting thread, I’m an urban design student at the Bartlett school of architecture battling with some of the issues mentioned above. I’ve chosen the site for my thesis project because I was initially attracted to the remnants of industrial activity at Brewery Wharf and wildlife before I became completely hooked on the sleepy, decaying atmosphere of the place. The only problem now is that I don’t want to adjust it or ‘design’ it in any way, which frustates my tutors because they just want me to call in the bulldozers and to ‘regenerate’ the area. I agree with El in that I think restoration isn’t the answer either but it’s a pity that more people don’t take the time to appreciate these beautiful decaying scenes.

Apart from letting nature run its course, is there any other way we should be protecting the area? Perhaps a slight augmentation or focusing of its natural beauty would allow more people to appreciate the creek so maybe it’s about setting up conditions for people to pause on it and celebrate it. I think it would be good if the creekside was more accessible also, apart from the Laban and the footbridge, it’s difficult to get close to it. Any further thoughts or suggestions are welcome.

By: Christine

Christine — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 23:24:50 +0000

So this is the Black Redstarts favourite type of habitat….”traditional nesting sites at open arid urban wasteland and old buildings, which tend to be associated with canals and railway lines”?

In the link you gave to the Black Redstarts plan for Deptford was the following:

“In London old flood defence structures along the Thames and the Lea Valley are of particular importance for Black redstarts….The algae and flora attached to old timbers help to support large numbers of Chironomid midges [NB. the midges emerge from aquatic larvae], an important food source for the black redstart. Development sites adjacent to rivers and canals should seek to improve flood defences to ensure that, where there is no timber present, it should be installed to provide a valuable vertical habitat for the black redstart.”

I never really thought of parts of London as being somehow equivalent to ‘an arid mountain style habitat. Obviously Black Redstarts view things differently from people!

The Laban Centre and Jacques Herzog and Pierre de Meuron should be congratulated for the inclusion of a ‘brown roof’….

By: Tom Turner

Tom Turner — Mon, 18 May 2009 18:21:09 +0000

Good idea re the pontoons. I guess the real requirement is a landscape strategy/plan/design for the waterspace and bankspace. A lot of money is being spent on re-developing the waterside land.

By: Erica

Erica — Mon, 18 May 2009 14:03:26 +0000

I would attach floating pontoons to the boats and fill them with fower and vegetables. Many people have to survive on the edge of water or fluctuating water levels.